Why is ra lower than re while la is higher than le?What are the Solfège names of the semitones between the...
Why is ra lower than re while la is higher than le?
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Why is ra lower than re while la is higher than le?
What are the Solfège names of the semitones between the basic do, re, mi, etc?Learning an alternative moving-do solfege — futile?History of screaming in music throughout the worldWhat pitches for singing “Movable Do”?What did ancient cuneiform notation look like, and how did it work?Find the origin of folkWhy are there 18 notes listed for chromatic scale tuningWhat does “H.=H” mean?What exactly is the “tonic sol–fa” system, and how is it different from solfège?Who titled 'Tonic sol-fa' and Why?Why does unpitched percussion play a less prominent role in classical music than many other genres?
According to Wikipedia and this answer, the solfège syllables for 2 and ♭2 are re and ra, respectively, while the solfège syllables for 6 and ♭6 are la and le, respectively. Is there a reason for this apparent inconsistency?
history solfege chromatic
asked 18 hours ago
Sam EstepSam Estep
1364
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Sam Estep is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
add a comment |
According to Wikipedia and this answer, the solfège syllables for 2 and ♭2 are re and ra, respectively, while the solfège syllables for 6 and ♭6 are la and le, respectively. Is there a reason for this apparent inconsistency?
history solfege chromatic
asked 18 hours ago
Sam EstepSam Estep
1364
New contributor
Sam Estep is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
add a comment |
According to Wikipedia and this answer, the solfège syllables for 2 and ♭2 are re and ra, respectively, while the solfège syllables for 6 and ♭6 are la and le, respectively. Is there a reason for this apparent inconsistency?
history solfege chromatic
asked 18 hours ago
Sam EstepSam Estep
1364
New contributor
Sam Estep is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
According to Wikipedia and this answer, the solfège syllables for 2 and ♭2 are re and ra, respectively, while the solfège syllables for 6 and ♭6 are la and le, respectively. Is there a reason for this apparent inconsistency?
history solfege chromatic
history solfege chromatic
asked 18 hours ago
Sam EstepSam Estep
1364
New contributor
Sam Estep is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
asked 18 hours ago
Sam EstepSam Estep
1364
New contributor
Sam Estep is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
asked 18 hours ago
Sam EstepSam Estep
1364
New contributor
Sam Estep is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
asked 18 hours ago
Sam EstepSam Estep
1364
asked 18 hours ago
Sam EstepSam Estep
1364
1364
New contributor
Sam Estep is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
New contributor
Sam Estep is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
Sam Estep is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
add a comment |
add a comment |
3 Answers
3
active
oldest
votes
That's because the solfege syllables for the non-chromatic notes (Do, Re, Mi, Fa, Sol, La, Si/Ti) were first. They were thoroughly historically anchored in music theory, long before someone thought about adding chromatically altered versions of them. Because most vowels were already used it was very difficult to invent a system 'on top' of the already known syllables that changes vowels consistently.
There's no other reason.
answered 18 hours ago
Tim HTim H
2,88611743
6
Just to expand on that, the syllables come from a Hymn to St. John. Guido d'Arezzo noticed that the first six lines of the hymn each began on a different syllable, Ut (the original name of do), Resonare, Mira, Famuli, Solve, Labii, Sancte Joannes (medieval Js looked like Is).got added later - the actual pitch in the hymn for the seventh line is Sol.
– Tom Serb
18 hours ago
2
I would write that as an answer. It doesn't so much expand as directly answer the question. Simply copy/pasting that would make the best answer on here.
– Aethenosity
11 hours ago
add a comment |
The diatonic notes, of course, came first. Sometime after that, the chromatic notes were described by the system. (It's important that we use Ti instead of Si, as you'll soon note.)
To sharpen notes, the vowel sound in the syllable was changed to i (rhymes with tree), as in Di, Ri, Fi, Si, Li, etc. To flatten notes, the vowel sound was changed to e (rhymes with day), as in Me, Se, Le, etc.
Sharp notes were easy; any note that could be sharpened worked just fine, as Mi and Ti already have the I and they can't really be sharp.
But FLAT notes pose a problem. The note "Re" already has the "e", and we often flatten the second. So, they decided to change the flat supertonic syllable to "Ra".
Chromatic scales with sharps and flats:
Do, Di, Re, Ri, Mi, Fa, Fi, So, Si, La, Li, Ti, Do
And
Do, Ra, Re, Me, Mi, Fa, Se, So, Le, La, Te, Ti, Do
answered 16 hours ago
user45266user45266
3,1701731
add a comment |
It is exactly like Tim says.
I’m used to sing la flat = lu.
Finally the spelling of the altered syllables doesn’t matter. You could also tell the flattened re and la: ru and lu.
Important is the association of the vocals and the function with the leading tone.
While mi and ti with the vowel i are up leading tones, analogical you can spell all up altered names adding an i:
Di, Ri, Fi, Si, Li
and all down leading tones adding a or u:
Ra, Ma, Sa, Lu, Ta or Ru, Mu, Su, Lu, Tu
The spelling of the altered tones differs from country to country. But this won’t cause any communication problems.
answered 17 hours ago
Albrecht HügliAlbrecht Hügli
2,204219
Interesting, thanks! Could you provide IPA transcriptions of the pronunciations of your alternative syllables? I'm curious...
– Sam Estep
17 hours ago
What do you mean by IPA?
– Albrecht Hügli
17 hours ago
Ah my apologies; I was referring to the International Phonetic Alphabet. But any method of transcribing the pronunciations would serve the purpose.
– Sam Estep
17 hours ago
2
Well , the vokals i and u are equal to ee and oo like see and pool. ;)
– Albrecht Hügli
16 hours ago
1
Not only the spelling alters. Working with French musos, who call the oft-used (horns) Bb 'si bemoll'. So is 'sol', sol u si how confusing something designed to be simple isn't...
– Tim
1 hour ago
|
show 2 more comments
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3 Answers
3
active
oldest
votes
3 Answers
3
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
That's because the solfege syllables for the non-chromatic notes (Do, Re, Mi, Fa, Sol, La, Si/Ti) were first. They were thoroughly historically anchored in music theory, long before someone thought about adding chromatically altered versions of them. Because most vowels were already used it was very difficult to invent a system 'on top' of the already known syllables that changes vowels consistently.
There's no other reason.
answered 18 hours ago
Tim HTim H
2,88611743
6
Just to expand on that, the syllables come from a Hymn to St. John. Guido d'Arezzo noticed that the first six lines of the hymn each began on a different syllable, Ut (the original name of do), Resonare, Mira, Famuli, Solve, Labii, Sancte Joannes (medieval Js looked like Is).got added later - the actual pitch in the hymn for the seventh line is Sol.
– Tom Serb
18 hours ago
2
I would write that as an answer. It doesn't so much expand as directly answer the question. Simply copy/pasting that would make the best answer on here.
– Aethenosity
11 hours ago
add a comment |
That's because the solfege syllables for the non-chromatic notes (Do, Re, Mi, Fa, Sol, La, Si/Ti) were first. They were thoroughly historically anchored in music theory, long before someone thought about adding chromatically altered versions of them. Because most vowels were already used it was very difficult to invent a system 'on top' of the already known syllables that changes vowels consistently.
There's no other reason.
answered 18 hours ago
Tim HTim H
2,88611743
6
Just to expand on that, the syllables come from a Hymn to St. John. Guido d'Arezzo noticed that the first six lines of the hymn each began on a different syllable, Ut (the original name of do), Resonare, Mira, Famuli, Solve, Labii, Sancte Joannes (medieval Js looked like Is).got added later - the actual pitch in the hymn for the seventh line is Sol.
– Tom Serb
18 hours ago
2
I would write that as an answer. It doesn't so much expand as directly answer the question. Simply copy/pasting that would make the best answer on here.
– Aethenosity
11 hours ago
add a comment |
That's because the solfege syllables for the non-chromatic notes (Do, Re, Mi, Fa, Sol, La, Si/Ti) were first. They were thoroughly historically anchored in music theory, long before someone thought about adding chromatically altered versions of them. Because most vowels were already used it was very difficult to invent a system 'on top' of the already known syllables that changes vowels consistently.
There's no other reason.
answered 18 hours ago
Tim HTim H
2,88611743
That's because the solfege syllables for the non-chromatic notes (Do, Re, Mi, Fa, Sol, La, Si/Ti) were first. They were thoroughly historically anchored in music theory, long before someone thought about adding chromatically altered versions of them. Because most vowels were already used it was very difficult to invent a system 'on top' of the already known syllables that changes vowels consistently.
There's no other reason.
answered 18 hours ago
Tim HTim H
2,88611743
answered 18 hours ago
Tim HTim H
2,88611743
answered 18 hours ago
Tim HTim H
2,88611743
answered 18 hours ago
Tim HTim H
2,88611743
2,88611743
6
Just to expand on that, the syllables come from a Hymn to St. John. Guido d'Arezzo noticed that the first six lines of the hymn each began on a different syllable, Ut (the original name of do), Resonare, Mira, Famuli, Solve, Labii, Sancte Joannes (medieval Js looked like Is).got added later - the actual pitch in the hymn for the seventh line is Sol.
– Tom Serb
18 hours ago
2
I would write that as an answer. It doesn't so much expand as directly answer the question. Simply copy/pasting that would make the best answer on here.
– Aethenosity
11 hours ago
add a comment |
6
Just to expand on that, the syllables come from a Hymn to St. John. Guido d'Arezzo noticed that the first six lines of the hymn each began on a different syllable, Ut (the original name of do), Resonare, Mira, Famuli, Solve, Labii, Sancte Joannes (medieval Js looked like Is).got added later - the actual pitch in the hymn for the seventh line is Sol.
– Tom Serb
18 hours ago
2
I would write that as an answer. It doesn't so much expand as directly answer the question. Simply copy/pasting that would make the best answer on here.
– Aethenosity
11 hours ago
6
6
Just to expand on that, the syllables come from a Hymn to St. John. Guido d'Arezzo noticed that the first six lines of the hymn each began on a different syllable, Ut (the original name of do), Resonare, Mira, Famuli, Solve, Labii, Sancte Joannes (medieval Js looked like Is).got added later - the actual pitch in the hymn for the seventh line is Sol.
– Tom Serb
18 hours ago
Just to expand on that, the syllables come from a Hymn to St. John. Guido d'Arezzo noticed that the first six lines of the hymn each began on a different syllable, Ut (the original name of do), Resonare, Mira, Famuli, Solve, Labii, Sancte Joannes (medieval Js looked like Is).got added later - the actual pitch in the hymn for the seventh line is Sol.
– Tom Serb
18 hours ago
2
2
I would write that as an answer. It doesn't so much expand as directly answer the question. Simply copy/pasting that would make the best answer on here.
– Aethenosity
11 hours ago
I would write that as an answer. It doesn't so much expand as directly answer the question. Simply copy/pasting that would make the best answer on here.
– Aethenosity
11 hours ago
add a comment |
The diatonic notes, of course, came first. Sometime after that, the chromatic notes were described by the system. (It's important that we use Ti instead of Si, as you'll soon note.)
To sharpen notes, the vowel sound in the syllable was changed to i (rhymes with tree), as in Di, Ri, Fi, Si, Li, etc. To flatten notes, the vowel sound was changed to e (rhymes with day), as in Me, Se, Le, etc.
Sharp notes were easy; any note that could be sharpened worked just fine, as Mi and Ti already have the I and they can't really be sharp.
But FLAT notes pose a problem. The note "Re" already has the "e", and we often flatten the second. So, they decided to change the flat supertonic syllable to "Ra".
Chromatic scales with sharps and flats:
Do, Di, Re, Ri, Mi, Fa, Fi, So, Si, La, Li, Ti, Do
And
Do, Ra, Re, Me, Mi, Fa, Se, So, Le, La, Te, Ti, Do
answered 16 hours ago
user45266user45266
3,1701731
add a comment |
The diatonic notes, of course, came first. Sometime after that, the chromatic notes were described by the system. (It's important that we use Ti instead of Si, as you'll soon note.)
To sharpen notes, the vowel sound in the syllable was changed to i (rhymes with tree), as in Di, Ri, Fi, Si, Li, etc. To flatten notes, the vowel sound was changed to e (rhymes with day), as in Me, Se, Le, etc.
Sharp notes were easy; any note that could be sharpened worked just fine, as Mi and Ti already have the I and they can't really be sharp.
But FLAT notes pose a problem. The note "Re" already has the "e", and we often flatten the second. So, they decided to change the flat supertonic syllable to "Ra".
Chromatic scales with sharps and flats:
Do, Di, Re, Ri, Mi, Fa, Fi, So, Si, La, Li, Ti, Do
And
Do, Ra, Re, Me, Mi, Fa, Se, So, Le, La, Te, Ti, Do
answered 16 hours ago
user45266user45266
3,1701731
add a comment |
The diatonic notes, of course, came first. Sometime after that, the chromatic notes were described by the system. (It's important that we use Ti instead of Si, as you'll soon note.)
To sharpen notes, the vowel sound in the syllable was changed to i (rhymes with tree), as in Di, Ri, Fi, Si, Li, etc. To flatten notes, the vowel sound was changed to e (rhymes with day), as in Me, Se, Le, etc.
Sharp notes were easy; any note that could be sharpened worked just fine, as Mi and Ti already have the I and they can't really be sharp.
But FLAT notes pose a problem. The note "Re" already has the "e", and we often flatten the second. So, they decided to change the flat supertonic syllable to "Ra".
Chromatic scales with sharps and flats:
Do, Di, Re, Ri, Mi, Fa, Fi, So, Si, La, Li, Ti, Do
And
Do, Ra, Re, Me, Mi, Fa, Se, So, Le, La, Te, Ti, Do
answered 16 hours ago
user45266user45266
3,1701731
The diatonic notes, of course, came first. Sometime after that, the chromatic notes were described by the system. (It's important that we use Ti instead of Si, as you'll soon note.)
To sharpen notes, the vowel sound in the syllable was changed to i (rhymes with tree), as in Di, Ri, Fi, Si, Li, etc. To flatten notes, the vowel sound was changed to e (rhymes with day), as in Me, Se, Le, etc.
Sharp notes were easy; any note that could be sharpened worked just fine, as Mi and Ti already have the I and they can't really be sharp.
But FLAT notes pose a problem. The note "Re" already has the "e", and we often flatten the second. So, they decided to change the flat supertonic syllable to "Ra".
Chromatic scales with sharps and flats:
Do, Di, Re, Ri, Mi, Fa, Fi, So, Si, La, Li, Ti, Do
And
Do, Ra, Re, Me, Mi, Fa, Se, So, Le, La, Te, Ti, Do
answered 16 hours ago
user45266user45266
3,1701731
answered 16 hours ago
user45266user45266
3,1701731
answered 16 hours ago
user45266user45266
3,1701731
answered 16 hours ago
user45266user45266
3,1701731
3,1701731
add a comment |
add a comment |
It is exactly like Tim says.
I’m used to sing la flat = lu.
Finally the spelling of the altered syllables doesn’t matter. You could also tell the flattened re and la: ru and lu.
Important is the association of the vocals and the function with the leading tone.
While mi and ti with the vowel i are up leading tones, analogical you can spell all up altered names adding an i:
Di, Ri, Fi, Si, Li
and all down leading tones adding a or u:
Ra, Ma, Sa, Lu, Ta or Ru, Mu, Su, Lu, Tu
The spelling of the altered tones differs from country to country. But this won’t cause any communication problems.
answered 17 hours ago
Albrecht HügliAlbrecht Hügli
2,204219
Interesting, thanks! Could you provide IPA transcriptions of the pronunciations of your alternative syllables? I'm curious...
– Sam Estep
17 hours ago
What do you mean by IPA?
– Albrecht Hügli
17 hours ago
Ah my apologies; I was referring to the International Phonetic Alphabet. But any method of transcribing the pronunciations would serve the purpose.
– Sam Estep
17 hours ago
2
Well , the vokals i and u are equal to ee and oo like see and pool. ;)
– Albrecht Hügli
16 hours ago
1
Not only the spelling alters. Working with French musos, who call the oft-used (horns) Bb 'si bemoll'. So is 'sol', sol u si how confusing something designed to be simple isn't...
– Tim
1 hour ago
|
show 2 more comments
It is exactly like Tim says.
I’m used to sing la flat = lu.
Finally the spelling of the altered syllables doesn’t matter. You could also tell the flattened re and la: ru and lu.
Important is the association of the vocals and the function with the leading tone.
While mi and ti with the vowel i are up leading tones, analogical you can spell all up altered names adding an i:
Di, Ri, Fi, Si, Li
and all down leading tones adding a or u:
Ra, Ma, Sa, Lu, Ta or Ru, Mu, Su, Lu, Tu
The spelling of the altered tones differs from country to country. But this won’t cause any communication problems.
answered 17 hours ago
Albrecht HügliAlbrecht Hügli
2,204219
Interesting, thanks! Could you provide IPA transcriptions of the pronunciations of your alternative syllables? I'm curious...
– Sam Estep
17 hours ago
What do you mean by IPA?
– Albrecht Hügli
17 hours ago
Ah my apologies; I was referring to the International Phonetic Alphabet. But any method of transcribing the pronunciations would serve the purpose.
– Sam Estep
17 hours ago
2
Well , the vokals i and u are equal to ee and oo like see and pool. ;)
– Albrecht Hügli
16 hours ago
1
Not only the spelling alters. Working with French musos, who call the oft-used (horns) Bb 'si bemoll'. So is 'sol', sol u si how confusing something designed to be simple isn't...
– Tim
1 hour ago
|
show 2 more comments
It is exactly like Tim says.
I’m used to sing la flat = lu.
Finally the spelling of the altered syllables doesn’t matter. You could also tell the flattened re and la: ru and lu.
Important is the association of the vocals and the function with the leading tone.
While mi and ti with the vowel i are up leading tones, analogical you can spell all up altered names adding an i:
Di, Ri, Fi, Si, Li
and all down leading tones adding a or u:
Ra, Ma, Sa, Lu, Ta or Ru, Mu, Su, Lu, Tu
The spelling of the altered tones differs from country to country. But this won’t cause any communication problems.
answered 17 hours ago
Albrecht HügliAlbrecht Hügli
2,204219
It is exactly like Tim says.
I’m used to sing la flat = lu.
Finally the spelling of the altered syllables doesn’t matter. You could also tell the flattened re and la: ru and lu.
Important is the association of the vocals and the function with the leading tone.
While mi and ti with the vowel i are up leading tones, analogical you can spell all up altered names adding an i:
Di, Ri, Fi, Si, Li
and all down leading tones adding a or u:
Ra, Ma, Sa, Lu, Ta or Ru, Mu, Su, Lu, Tu
The spelling of the altered tones differs from country to country. But this won’t cause any communication problems.
answered 17 hours ago
Albrecht HügliAlbrecht Hügli
2,204219
answered 17 hours ago
Albrecht HügliAlbrecht Hügli
2,204219
answered 17 hours ago
Albrecht HügliAlbrecht Hügli
2,204219
answered 17 hours ago
Albrecht HügliAlbrecht Hügli
2,204219
2,204219
Interesting, thanks! Could you provide IPA transcriptions of the pronunciations of your alternative syllables? I'm curious...
– Sam Estep
17 hours ago
What do you mean by IPA?
– Albrecht Hügli
17 hours ago
Ah my apologies; I was referring to the International Phonetic Alphabet. But any method of transcribing the pronunciations would serve the purpose.
– Sam Estep
17 hours ago
2
Well , the vokals i and u are equal to ee and oo like see and pool. ;)
– Albrecht Hügli
16 hours ago
1
Not only the spelling alters. Working with French musos, who call the oft-used (horns) Bb 'si bemoll'. So is 'sol', sol u si how confusing something designed to be simple isn't...
– Tim
1 hour ago
|
show 2 more comments
Interesting, thanks! Could you provide IPA transcriptions of the pronunciations of your alternative syllables? I'm curious...
– Sam Estep
17 hours ago
What do you mean by IPA?
– Albrecht Hügli
17 hours ago
Ah my apologies; I was referring to the International Phonetic Alphabet. But any method of transcribing the pronunciations would serve the purpose.
– Sam Estep
17 hours ago
2
Well , the vokals i and u are equal to ee and oo like see and pool. ;)
– Albrecht Hügli
16 hours ago
1
Not only the spelling alters. Working with French musos, who call the oft-used (horns) Bb 'si bemoll'. So is 'sol', sol u si how confusing something designed to be simple isn't...
– Tim
1 hour ago
Interesting, thanks! Could you provide IPA transcriptions of the pronunciations of your alternative syllables? I'm curious...
– Sam Estep
17 hours ago
Interesting, thanks! Could you provide IPA transcriptions of the pronunciations of your alternative syllables? I'm curious...
– Sam Estep
17 hours ago
What do you mean by IPA?
– Albrecht Hügli
17 hours ago
What do you mean by IPA?
– Albrecht Hügli
17 hours ago
Ah my apologies; I was referring to the International Phonetic Alphabet. But any method of transcribing the pronunciations would serve the purpose.
– Sam Estep
17 hours ago
Ah my apologies; I was referring to the International Phonetic Alphabet. But any method of transcribing the pronunciations would serve the purpose.
– Sam Estep
17 hours ago
2
2
Well , the vokals i and u are equal to ee and oo like see and pool. ;)
– Albrecht Hügli
16 hours ago
Well , the vokals i and u are equal to ee and oo like see and pool. ;)
– Albrecht Hügli
16 hours ago
1
1
Not only the spelling alters. Working with French musos, who call the oft-used (horns) Bb 'si bemoll'. So is 'sol', sol u si how confusing something designed to be simple isn't...
– Tim
1 hour ago
Not only the spelling alters. Working with French musos, who call the oft-used (horns) Bb 'si bemoll'. So is 'sol', sol u si how confusing something designed to be simple isn't...
– Tim
1 hour ago
|
show 2 more comments
Sam Estep is a new contributor. Be nice, and check out our Code of Conduct.
Sam Estep is a new contributor. Be nice, and check out our Code of Conduct.
Sam Estep is a new contributor. Be nice, and check out our Code of Conduct.
Sam Estep is a new contributor. Be nice, and check out our Code of Conduct.
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